topic posted Tue, July 17, 2007 - 7:23 AM by  Remi Love
Do astrologers worry about a planet's decan or co-ruler? Should people consider this extra info? Like for example, my sister is a 20 degree Libra, I believe, but her co-ruler is Aquarius. And when you comes to it, she's is a rebellious Libra. She wants her freedom sooo bad; I probably have to include her damn Aries Moon and possibly Sag rising. Thanks.
posted by:
Remi Love
New Jersey
  • Re: Decans

    Tue, July 17, 2007 - 7:35 AM
    And my dad too, he is a 10 degree Scorpio, has that Scorpio bite but he's more sensitive and empathetic; he owns a day care center and you should look into his eyes when he sees those 3 to 4 year kids. Pure compassion. It's probably that Neptune/ Pisces co-ruler and undertones. I have the same Pisces co-ruler with my moon too. The weirdest thing is that with me, he doesn't want to make me mad or angry. He's very sensitive around and I feel like too. A man with Scorpio and Pisces influences? Phenomenal! And then my mom is 1 degree Gemini. Very gemini like!
    • Unsu...

      Re: Decans

      Tue, July 17, 2007 - 8:22 AM
      I too consider them and find 'em very helful and descriptive especially when it comes to the great 3 (sun, moon and asc)

    • FJ
      offline 6

      Re: Decans

      Tue, July 17, 2007 - 6:36 PM
      >And my dad too, he is a 10 degree Scorpio, has that Scorpio bite but he's more sensitive and empathetic; he owns a day care center and you should look into his eyes when he sees those 3 to 4 year kids. Pure compassion.<
      My Moon is at 4* Scorpio, and I have to say (at the risk of sounding sappy) that I'm deeply touched by that. I can relate. It's beautiful. I once had a girlfriend (a Taurus) who was actually considerably older than me, but she told me I have a "strong loving paternal instinct". I had absolutely no ego about accepting the compliment. I only hope it's true, for the benefit of someone somewhere.....someday.
      • FJ
        offline 6

        Re: Decans

        Tue, July 17, 2007 - 6:43 PM
        I have NEVER been intimidated by the idea of "childcare" as being strictly a woman's role. I am not too macho to accept the more nurturing and compassionate aspects of childcare as something ANYONE SHOULD be able to do. I look forward to it in my own life.
  • Unsu...

    Re: Decans

    Tue, July 17, 2007 - 8:23 AM
    The decants, even degree the rising sign is in is significant -I can't say I worry about it but I do look at that with rising signs.
    Libra Aries ha ! hope you have your own room.
  • Unsu...

    Re: Decans

    Tue, July 17, 2007 - 9:55 AM
    Vedic perspective...

    We call the decan chart the drekkana, or 3rd divisional chart. It's created by splitting all the signs into three parts of 10 degrees each. The first drekkana of a sign is the same as that sign. The second drekkana is the next sign in the zodiac of the same element, and the third drekkana is the next sign after that of the same element. The drekkana is an actual chart, separate from the natal chart but based on the natal chart. I think these are called harmonic charts in Western astrology.

    Since it is the 3rd divisional chart, the drekkana relates to the 3rd house, so it shows a person's relationship to their siblings. The 3rd house also has to do with our desire for life, our courage to face the struggles in life, and how we channel our energy towards the things we want. The most important planet to look at in the drekkana chart is Mars, which is a nature indicator of the 3rd house and corresponds to the number 3 in Vedic numerology.

    For example, I am a Cancer Rising with Ascendant at 10 degrees Cancer and Mars in the 2nd house at 3 degrees of Leo. So in my drekkana, I am Scorpio with Mars in Leo again, but in the 10th house, because Leo is the 10th sign from Scorpio. I think it's simpler to create the divisional charts using equal sign houses. Not sure how you'd do it with all the fancy interceptions and stuff of Western house methods. Since the divisional charts are not astronomically based like the main natal chart, you are just considering the sign relationships of things.

    The drekkana is one of the varga charts (divisional charts) that I haven't spent a lot of time on, so I don't really have an anecdote for it. I mostly focus on the navamsa (9th varga) used for relationships, and the dasamsa (10th varga) used for career, as well as others. There are 16 total, so lot's of information is in the vargas. But the drekkana is considered very important, just like the decans are important in Western astrology. It's essentially the same thing. And my Rising and Sun go to Scorpio, hmmm...

    Thanks, you just made me realize I do have an important Scorpio placement in my tropical chart, which I hadn't considered before. I knew it was there somewhere! I recently switched from the sidereal to the tropical zodiac, so I'm having to learn everything all over again. But I do have some subtle Scorpio qualities at times..

    • Unsu...

      Re: Decans

      Tue, July 17, 2007 - 10:24 AM
      I meant to say whole sign houses, not equal houses. Get those terms confused all the time!
  • Unsu...

    Re: Decans

    Tue, July 17, 2007 - 10:07 AM
    my scorpio sun is on the cancer decan.. and i am also cancer moon.. so hmm yeah ther is kind'a canceristic vibe going on with me..
  • FJ
    offline 6

    Re: Decans

    Tue, July 17, 2007 - 11:32 AM
    Decans provide important clues as to how an individual progresses through life, or at least how they are learning learning the lessons of a particular Zodiac sign. I think your sister's Aries Moon and Sagg Rising probably play a larger role in her apparent rebellious streak than the Aquarius decan does. Sagg, Aries and Aquarius are all SUPER indpendent and are kind of like the Three Amigos of the zodiac. I tend to think Aries makes for even crazier rebels than Aquarius does. Some of the most violent revolutionaries had strong Aries personalities. Aquarius challenges existing systems because experimentation is their forte and they aren't satisfied until they have explored all the options and made a decision for themself. Aquarius has Aries on the cusp of the 3rd House, so the need for independent self-motivated thinking is obvious. Aquarius gets its rebellious streak from Saggitarius which is on the house-cusp traditionally ruled by Aquarius. One archetype for Sagg is wild horses. This concept rules the 11th House of associations in an Aquarius chart. They want to be free of social expectations, but if you look at the Aquarian 9th House which is ruled by LIBRA, their philosophy of life is peace. Aries has Sagg on this house cusp, so FREEDOM to do as they please is really the core philosophy of their life! Aries challenges existing systems (or rocks the boat, anyway) because they really want to run the show. They DON'T want to take orders because that symbolizes the ultimate opposition to achieving their goals. They have to butt someone else show off the air before they can go on. That's rebelliousness in pure form, in my opinion.
    I think your sister's Aquarius decan means that she likes to participate in experimental and unique activities. Libras like to try new things and be exposed to what is "advant gaurde", and then weigh up and judge the experience. This is the arena where she finds the most stimulus. I have a friend in the Aqu decan of Libra, and he does the same. He tries unusual new things and then comes up with a whole critique and memoire of the experience.

    I'm not sure "worry" is the word I'd use to describe my feelings about using decans.
    I have never seen any concrete technical explanation as to WHY decans work...but by all appearances they simply do, so I use them. The mechanism of decans is one most elusive phenomenons in astrology. My guess is that it has something to do with a true extra-dimension which operates inside astrology or astronomy, which we don't fully understand because humans are kind of stuck in a 3D existence. It's based on a geometric principle we don't really understand. Something which is so peripheral we can't put our finger on it...but it's there and does effect us.

    My Sun is at 17* Aquarius, therefore in the Gemini decan. I do tend to be very inclined to writing and communicating even though I have no actual planets in Gemini. I also tend to be somewhat multi-faceted, but to a much lesser degree than a Gemini. The difference is, most Geminis won't really talk much about how they are multi-faceted because they are so busy BEING multi-faceted they have no clear perspective on the Big Picture. The Big Picture is Aquarius's realm. I fully acknowledge that I am multi-facted, and I would try my best to explain to you objectively and conciously about each one of my facets, one-by-one. I am not devious or deceptive, and "pure" Geminis aren't really either. They just experience and live-out each one of their facets idealistically, they normally don't see all their facets as being part of a bigger picture.

    Another thing about decans is that they imply a house position for the expression of the larger sign they are in. (Maybe "HARMONIC" is a better word than "house"). For example, if a person with their Sun in Aries is actually in the Sagg decan of Aries...that has a 9th House connotation because Sagg is the 9th House in an Aries chart. Leo would be the 2nd decan and 5th house to Aries.
    Citing myself as an example again, Gemini symbolizes the 5th HARMONIC of Aquarius, or the 5th House. The 5th harmonic is the level of self-expression which deals with games, adventures and risk-taking. It is an area of applicaiton for my Aquarius sun - the arena where I engage in activities which sharpen my character. I LOVE mental puzzles and games and cryptic and enigmatic challenges! I apply my Aquarian/Uranian intuition with a Mercurial twist for intellectual problem-solving. I'm the kind of guy who really analyzes the Lotto numbers in a very unconventional way sometimes, and I experiment with different approaches to see if it yields better luck. That's Aquarius operating through the Gemini decan in a manner consistent with the 5th Harmonic. A person who is a "pure" 1st decan Aquarius is more likely to be a "typical" Aquarius personality, more consistent with the stereotypes and generalizations made in your average beginner's astrology book. All Aquariuses tend to be somewhat flaky or eccentric, but the first decan takes the Grand prize. As you progress through a sign, the core tendencies of the sign tend to be smoothed out by other influences. It's very important if you want to understand how a person is experiencing the sign he was born under. My Jupiter is at 29*56' Sagg in the first house, almost in Capricorn. I may have some strong Sagg charactristics...but the Leo decan and Capricorn cusp makes me much more conservative, reserved, dignified, disciplined and stable than your average Sagg. Nevertheless, I still like to philosophize and idealize and take shots at the "truth" like a normal Sagg does.

    The further you move through a zodiac sign, the less pure it becomes and it starts to blend with other elements. There are even smaller denominations - a zodiac sign also has harmonics which are divided into 12ths, so in effect every sign has all the other signs enveloped in it! This is especially true of Pisces, as Pisces is a culmination of all the other signs.

    The mechanism and theory of decans is really about different harmonics of the zodiac operating within and being reflected by every sign of the Zodiac. It is true Quantum Theory, basically...that you can unlock the ultimate "secret" of the Universe by delving deeper and deeper into particulate matter...and I guess the same works for astrology. You can find the Universe in every corner of the Zodiac if you know how the dimensions are intertwined. Chinese and Vedic astrology both deal with decan-like facets on a level FAR more complex than Western astrology. They depict it with crazy layered wheels which resemble the multi-faceted Mayan calendar and time-codexes. By this token, there are decans within decans within decans within decans...which sometimes necessitates the construction of complex or layered pictographs to represent them because decans are based on a geometry which goes beyond the scope of 3-D representation.

    A person born in the middle decan of a sign is generally considered the most balanced of anyone born in the sign. This is because they have a middle-of-the-road perspective of the concept of "coming and going". They have a strong identity associated with the archetype of the sign but they are also aware that something else lies ahead for them. In biology, generally pure-breeds have less immunity to disease than mutts. A person born in the middle of a sign has more archetypal resources to draw from in the evolution of his personality. In addition to knowing where he is going and where he has been, he also has the harmonic of the 2nd decan to further color his character.
    A person who is born in the last decan of a sign is beginning to see the light at the end of the tunnel quite clearly. He may occasionally show some of the characteristics of the Zodiac sign that lies beyond his, and the closer he gets to that light (the final degree of his sign) the more he is fooled into thinking he has completed the course. This is called the anaretic degree: The last degree of the 3rd decan of a Zodiac sign. Such a person is probably being called on to utilize a number of different energies in the completion of the sign, and the decans play a larger role the further a planet progresses through a sign.

    Consider the relationship between the 3rd decan and the entirely new sign you are about to cross into as the root sign is completed. For instance, the Sun at 29* Libra is in the Gemini decan of Libra, and the Sun is about to pass into the first (and most pure) decan of Scorpio. Gemini is quincunx to Scorpio. Since quincunxs are about subtle adjustments that need to be made, that is the ultimate lesson of every sign. A quincunx is a form of "inconjunct", and so is a semi-sextile....and remember, the root sign is semi-sextile and therefore inconjunct to it's neighbor...ONCE AGAIN ABOUT MAKING SUBTLE ADJUSTMENTS. That's the most important secret of learning to navigate around the Karmic Wheel. 3rd Decan people also tend to be especially philosophical and Jupiterian in their outlook, because of the 9th House connotation. Only by expanding their horizons and contemplating their experiences...and by actually viewing their life as a JOURNEY can they complete the lessons of the sign.

    The 1st decan establishes the basic identity of the sign. Keyword: BLIND FAITH
    The 2nd decan provides risks & activities which accelerate the growth. Keyword: CONFLICT
    The 3rd decan indicates the search for a new philosophy of life. Keyword: ADJUSTMENT

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